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Post by Todd on May 19, 2017 15:20:58 GMT -5
I don't know about the issues with The Vault, but isn't it just a matter of self control for those who enjoy the puzzles not to look at the hints and answers? We are, by nature, competitive beings. Whether we're demonstrating our physical prowess on the athletic field, or our mental agility in a puzzle competition, we seek the sense of satisfaction that comes from a job well done. Imagine, though, if you were running a marathon and then found out that some people were allowed to start at the same time as you, but only 50 yards from the finish line. While you may view it as a matter of pride to run the entire course, finishing 101st because 100 people started 50 yards from the finish line would make you rightfully disappointed. I've always said that I consider this more of a team sport than a competition, and I view every last one of you as teammates. I lean on you. You lean on me. We may end up collapsing and crawling over the finish line together, but I'm not going to leave you behind. And when we finally make it across the line, do we really want to see a room full of well rested people who got there by reading the answers in the Codex weeks ago? I don't intend discount or invalidate your opinion, thegenii. I think you genuinely seek to understand the other side, and hope I can help you comprehend, while respecting your right to disagree.
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Post by dmikester on May 19, 2017 16:08:59 GMT -5
Also, thegenii, The Vault is purposefully designed to be somewhat competitive; for the Vaults in Volume 2 and 3, they list the order that people solve The Vault in, and the people who opened the Vaults for Volume 1 and 2 first received special physical prizes from the MPC. It's definitely a gentle competition (this is much more about the journey than the final reward), but I'd say it's an inherent part of this particular experience.
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Post by thegenii on May 19, 2017 19:43:33 GMT -5
Ah, okay: I'm not much of a competitor, so that explains some things. I really wasn't trying to make a point one way or the other ... just trying to understand.
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Post by Virginia R Hall on May 20, 2017 12:11:25 GMT -5
I don't especially care for the new Codex, but only because I feel I've gotten to know our little community so well, that I'd rather share hints here than just skip to the answer there. When I first joined, I purchased the catch-ups before exploring the Sitting Room, and quite honestly, when I saw that there was a community aspect to some of the puzzles, I was horrified. I'm fine with collaboration, but I'm terrible at asking for help and everyone seemed so clever, I thought there was no way I could keep up. I got through V1 largely through solo research and with an enormous amount of help from the Wiki. V2 was more difficult, as I'd joined halfway through and there was only so much I could do on my own, so I lurked in the chat room a bit and over time spoke up and got to know people and eventually even helped others through puzzles. Because of that experience, the Codex seems cold to me. It feels like flipping to the back of the crossword book and just copying the answers into the grid -- putting the focus on the destination, not the journey. However, if I were new, I think I'd really appreciate it as a sort of primer. I do hope that in the future, they consider not posting the actual answers, or at least delay them until the following quarter or even until the entire volume has wrapped. I like to have answers or at least being able to confirm them (a la the V3 Vault), but really, one of my fondest MPC memories is the chat room after V3Ch4 (Cook's) came out and we were endlessly puzzling over the Bungle and the Horse Ad.
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Eleduar
Assistant
Sitter of the original sitting room. Vault 3 opener. Lover of mystery, otherworldy, supernatural.
Posts: 68
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Post by Eleduar on May 21, 2017 8:12:06 GMT -5
Hey everyone. I'm kinda new here but I've definitely been taking a liking to C&C and all the intricate puzzles and interesting stories that we're all so fond of. I'm sure some people are still waiting on their delivery and have yet to even tackle the puzzles, but a good portion of people do have it by the poll in the issue 1 thread. For everyone who has been working on it...what do you all think of MPC implementing the codex? Personally I am not a fan of the idea. I think the intention is nice, but I think it defeats a lot of the cooperative fun of C&C. I came to the game late (at the very end of volume 3) so while I was going through the back issues, I was referencing a lot of the threads here and I just was so excited by all the cooperation and helping each other along in the puzzles. And before volume 3s end when there was the sitting room (which I never got to see) that sounded like it was even more fun. I like the idea of working on all this stuff together and building a community around it. Now with the codex, they hand the answers to you on a silver platter (if you want them) and kinda defeat some of the mystery by making it so easy to get the answers. I did reference some of the "hints" in the codex to help get me on the right path, but such things as the ability to reveal letters on "rosswor" and "the odds are stacked against me" I feel are too much of a give away. Then there is the section that just gives you all the answers. Anyway..I'm just rambling, but I thought this was a really new and interesting aspect of C&C and I haven't seen a forum post about it yet. What is everyone's opinions? Cheers! Hello, Jindae, thank you for your question. My opinion is that I do not like the codex. It is as you say, taking away from the camaraderie that has developed. It also removes the sense of mystery and wonder, with a feel more akin to a puzzle book one can find on a magazine isle in the local supermarket; the answers listed neatly in the back. I joined the MPC in late 2015, and subscribed to volume 3 throughout 2016. Since then, I have met many wonderful, talented, incredibly gifted and intelligent MPC members through various forms of internet communication. My favorite was the sitting room. Indeed, my new best friend I met first through the sitting room. I have also since met lovely people and friends on this forum, as well as on twitter. In addition, the puzzles and newspaper of volume 3 have brought me closer to some of the people in my personal life. One of my dear friends visited more often, and we bent over the pages eagerly together for hours. I remembered the joy of the wonder in her eyes of the dark mysteries that seemed to sneak out in the strangest and most peculiar ways. The funny quizzical expressions she wore when I showed her a complex thing I had puzzled out, and how she interrogated me with questions when she didn't quite understand something, marveling at my many pages of hand drawn diagrams and scribbled notes of hypotheses. I was also awestruck more than once at the feeling of inclusion and professionalism by the MPC, and the very tender and wonderful personal feeling that came from receiving replies from the Curator himself, as well as his very witty (and lengthy) cryptic missives. Please excuse my bluntness, but I feel much of this has been traded away. The sense of community traded for a lonely puzzling pastime. The air of mystery for something more google-headline. The meticulously clue-filled missives for spammed sales pitches. The richly deep layers of puzzles for a hunk of pewter. The precious sense of being a very special member, to just one of the less important, not-throwing-money-constantly-at-them people. These are my opinions, and I thank you again for asking. My intention is not to sway or deter anyone here, I simply feel stung by the abrupt change in feel of the MPC as a whole. I hope at least my past experiences have kindled some interest for you, and that if you have not already, partake in the very spectacular volume three. I hear also, that volumes 1 and 2 are likewise thrilling. Yours truly, Eleduar
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Post by mkarrett on May 21, 2017 18:15:56 GMT -5
This is going to be the dumbest question ever.....what is The Codex?
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The Codex
May 21, 2017 18:18:03 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by wortelboer on May 21, 2017 18:18:03 GMT -5
This is going to be the dumbest question ever.....what is The Codex? The hint page referenced near the puzzles
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Post by mkarrett on May 21, 2017 18:52:09 GMT -5
This is going to be the dumbest question ever.....what is The Codex? The hint page referenced near the puzzles Oh geez the thing I avoided like a plague because I don't want the solutions. Now that I solved the meta puzzle for this volume I took a peeky-poo. I'm super sad The Powers That Be are just giving the answers away. It's an easy out for people that are a little stuck and don't want to bother working for the answer.
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Post by wortelboer on May 21, 2017 18:55:12 GMT -5
The hint page referenced near the puzzles Oh geez the thing I avoided like a plague because I don't want the solutions. Now that I solved the meta puzzle for this volume I took a peeky-poo. I'm super sad The Powers That Be are just giving the answers away. It's an easy out for people that are a little stuck and don't want to bother working for the answer. A lot of us feel that way. There are quite a few on the board here that are not looking at the Codex, preferring instead to continue to solve puzzles and get help through this community instead.
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Post by femspock on May 22, 2017 13:38:12 GMT -5
Hi everyone. Not to be creepy, but I've lurked on this forum for so long, I feel like I know you all. Anyways, this change seemed inevitable. Finding people who are truly advanced puzzlers and who actually enjoy taking several days (if not weeks) to solve a puzzle isn't easy. I was so thrilled with Volume 3. While the need to be "accessible" for the purposes of securing subscriptions certainly makes sense from a practical standpoint, I'm intensely disappointed that they're apparently attempting to appeal to the lowest common denominator (especially since I'm not certain it'll be effective--puzzlers who require spoon-feeding are casuals at best and aren't likely to stay subscribed anyway). Honestly, I'd rather pay double for the subscription and receive a product that entertains and challenges me for months than have it stripped and reduced to a quirky novelty subscription, watered down for people who aren't *actual* puzzlers. C&C is by far my favorite "special thing" and I look forward to it tremendously. Finding challenging layered puzzles that tie into narratives or anything even remotely close to what C&C offers is impossible. If C&C continues a downward slide into mediocrity--ugh, I'm just so tired of everything being dumbed down for people too busy, lazy, or unmotivated to do much more than the bare minimum. Those people can keep their word searches and sudoku apps. We aren't the Bejeweled/Farmville crowd--can't we have our one cool thing? Lol. It can be pretty isolating when mainstream entertainment outlets tend to be so banal and repetitive. I've always loved that C&C stepped away from what's easy and marketable and made something that felt like it was exclusively designed for people who truly do appreciate complex puzzles and all of the other things that make C&C so spectacular. This may be an effort to make the C&C friendlier to a larger audience and if that means more profit for the Company and thus more C&C then I'll begrudgingly accept it. So, this is where I'm at for now too. I'll wait and watch, and when it becomes evident that C&C can't offer me anything more than what I can find literally anywhere and everywhere else, I'll be done (but keeping a careful watch on the recommendations forums here for new ways to spend my time and money). :/ In the meantime, I'm hoping this is an elaborate part of the Volume 4 storyline, where the Curator and Editor are at odds, and eventually the Curator wins. While unlikely, it isn't something I would put past them, especially if this were an ongoing debate in their actual offices. Should that not be the case, here's hoping it's an experiment, and that the passage of time (and relentless negative feedback) prove it to be a failure.
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Post by clemtownkernel on May 22, 2017 15:48:55 GMT -5
We've got to keep in mind too that this is only the first issue of the new volume - who knows what sort of twists and turns the next ones will take us in? I made the mistake, to my own shame, of trying to take shortcuts early on when I first discovered the C&C and it only added to my frustration down the line - so if anyone reading this IS tempted to just fill in the blanks using the codex instead of really trying to understand the puzzles I warn you from experience, you do so at your own peril. If I'm wrong about that for Volume 4 then I share the same concerns as our lurker.
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Post by wortelboer on May 22, 2017 15:51:01 GMT -5
We've got to keep in mind too that this is only the first issue of the new volume - who knows what sort of twists and turns the next ones will take us in? I made the mistake, to my own shame, of trying to take shortcuts early on when I first discovered the C&C and it only added to my frustration down the line - so if anyone reading this IS tempted to just fill in the blanks using the codex instead of really trying to understand the puzzles I warn you from experience, you do so at your own peril. If I'm wrong about that for Volume 4 then I share the same concerns as our lurker. I agree. For the deeper dive this it is imperative to do the work. You need to understand how to solve the puzzle in order to move forward. If you attempt to take shortcuts you'll never be able to solve the deeper puzzles. If, of course, there are any anymore
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Post by offsky on May 24, 2017 14:57:43 GMT -5
I too dislike the codex. But I think it would be pretty cool if there where two solutions to the puzzles and the codex gave the false solution to satisfy the amateur players and the "true" solution that hardcore puzzlers discovered would be used for subsequent layers of the puzzle. Assuming there are subsequent layers like there used to be. I will be very disappointed if there are no layers.
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The Codex
May 29, 2017 10:48:50 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by inarusherpa on May 29, 2017 10:48:50 GMT -5
Has anyone had problems with The Vault yet? The "cannot make a single mistake" bit? Well, I can't get it to enter a single letter. It's starting at the far right, I've entered words backwards. I've entered the last puzzle first and the first puzzle first. I've even sent the Curator a note. My Vault is a true Vault, and oddly, I have not seen the codex. Maybe I'm not looking, I've also been hindquarters in John Augur. (Great experience!) I'm so confused after getting Gods and Monsters I am losing interest in solving the puzzles if there's no point in the Vault.
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Post by thebardess on May 29, 2017 11:17:35 GMT -5
Has anyone had problems with The Vault yet? The "cannot make a single mistake" bit? Well, I can't get it to enter a single letter. It's starting at the far right, I've entered words backwards. I've entered the last puzzle first and the first puzzle first. I've even sent the Curator a note. My Vault is a true Vault, and oddly, I have not seen the codex. Maybe I'm not looking, I've also been hindquarters in John Augur. (Great experience!) I'm so confused after getting Gods and Monsters I am losing interest in solving the puzzles if there's no point in the Vault. Which Vault are you working on? It sounds like the Volume 1 Vault, in which case the answers are all in the five issues that comprise Volume 1. Do you have any of the back issues or catch-up kits?
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